From Real Estate to Results: How Leadership Drives Success

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:00:41

Well, hello, everybody, and welcome to another amazing episode of the Unstoppable Successpodcast. I am your host, Jaclyn Strominger. And on this podcast, as you know, we hear from amazing leaders and we get insights into their.

The things that help them be game changers in their industry and be game changing in their leadership. And today, I have the absolute pleasure of introducing you to Joe Kavanagh. Let me tell you a little bit about Joe.

So, first of all, Joe and I met on another podcast, and so I was so excited to have him on this one, as you know. So great.

But with over 40 years in sales and marketing expertise in business, Joe brings a wealth of experience and insight to his business, to his coaching, and his team guides corporations, sales professionals, entrepreneurs, and business owners to refine their approach, improve communication, and drive results. The ultimate mission for Joe is to empower you with tools that create meaningful connections, improve conversations, and accelerate business growth.

And as you all know, those are some of the best characteristics that leaders need to have. So welcome, Joe, to Unstoppable Success podcast.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:02:01

Thank you, Jaclyn. It's an honor to be on your show, and I appreciate you having me as a guest.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:02:06

Oh, my God, it's such a pleasure. So, Joe, you know, we were. We've, we've talked. Before you started your career, you were in real estate. So I'm really curious.

You know, real estate, there's so many different avenues about real estate, but. And I look at a real estate professional as somebody who's leading a family or an individual into something that's really big and different.

Like, it's. It's like, again, you know, buying a property or anything in real estate, it's a huge time in someone's life, business, whatever.

So I'd love for you to share your insight and how leadership really impacts that real estate process and how it. And how it has changed and impacted the way you lead.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:02:58

Okay, so that's a loaded question, but I. Yep. I feel like that's a good one. That's a good one. And people want to know the answer. So put me right on the hot seat. Yeah.

In real estate especially, typically, it's the biggest decision people are making in their lives, and it's often the most stressful. So what are the signs of a good leader, a good realtor? To me, it's somebody, first of all, you got to have integrity, and you've got to be honest.

And one of the things I tell people when I first sit down to talk to them about possibly working together. And to me, that's an interview. And not to get too far off track, but they're interviewing me, see if I'm the best agent for them.

But I'm also interviewing them to see if we're a good fit. And I tell them that right up front.

I say, look, if you don't feel I'm a good fit for you or the best agent for what you want to accomplish, maybe you have a clash of personalities or something. Just tell me. Be honest with me. I want you to be honest. You have my permission to say no. That usually drops all the defenses. And people sit back.

You can see them relax in their posture, and it puts them at ease. Because as, again, it's a stressful situation when they're starting out. They have so many unknowns. It's incredible. And I do tell them this too.

They said, look, I'm not going to make decisions for you. You have a lot of blanks that you need to fill in before you can come to a good decision.

I can give you that information so that you can make an informed decision. And a lot of these things just, again, calm them down. And they say, okay, so he's not just a salesman coming in to try to sell me his services.

And especially in real estate, it happens a lot where an agent will tell the person what they want to hear just so they can get the paperwork signed. For example, let's say your house is truly worth about 500,000 in the market.

And there we get a lot of sellers who still think they have the best house there is in the neighborhood. Best view. That's a lot. The whole thing, everything's the best, right? And honestly, you could be sitting in the worst house in the neighborhood.

And they will say, well, we were hoping to get closer to 600,000. Now there are agents out there, and I'm not putting agents down, but unfortunately, it's probably like this in any industry.

They will say, okay, if you want to go with 6,000, let's do it here. Sign the paperwork. Right? I'm going to tell them the truth.

I'll say, look, here's what the market's showing, and if you want to get any more than that, I feel confident enough that I'm the best agent. I'm your best chance of getting that. So again, you're leading them, but you're not misleading them, right? There's a fine line there.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:05:49

You know, it's so true. There is that fine line. And what you're saying, I think, is actually really, you know, there is. You're talking about Trust and honesty and fit.

And one thing that I actually kind of want to bring it back into the corporate world is that those, those pieces are so important, so important at a company when somebody is, is taking the step to become an employee, become part of the tribe. Right. Of that company. You know, the hiring person, the CEO, the, the management has to be honest with the people that are coming into the tribe.

And you have to be able to also make sure that it's the right fit all around. Somebody might want the position and like I need them, I need the job.

And they, they might be good and they might, you know, the company might like them, but they're not the right fit. Maybe they don't. Right, right. They don't, they don't meet the same as I call it the achievement code. Right. The achievement code's not there. Right.

So I love that you brought up honesty and fit because I think it is in, in all businesses. It has to, that has to be there.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:07:08

Yes, absolutely. And Jack, I'm so glad you, you did the transfer over to that of the segue. That was the word I was looking for.

And because the number one issue, and we do training from anywhere from solopreneurs up to corporations and coaching and training and mentoring. The number one problem in any corporation, I don't care how big or small they are. What do you think that is? It's communication.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:07:37

I was going to say. I was going to say communication and how people actually feel valued or not valued at a company.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:07:44

Beautiful boy. It's. Are you sure you didn't get my talk? Because that's exactly where I was going.

Here's the thing, and this is one of the courses that we teach is about communication. How to build proper relationships, how to communicate with others by understanding others, not making them coerce to your way of thinking.

And there are easy methods to do that.

I can figure out somebody's personality, their value system, and the communic preferred communication style in less than 90 seconds with one of the methods that we employ. And once you do that, now I understand. Okay. They don't think like me. They think in a different way. For example, how many times have you heard this?

Especially if you're in a corporate world Now, I will admit I've never been in the corporate world. Thank God. I don't think I could survive it week in that I'm too independent. But I hear a lot of people that say this.

And they'll say three of us can be sitting in the same conference meeting and we walk out of there and start talking about what we got out of it. And we could have three different takes that we got three different messages like, oh, I didn't, I didn't get that. I got this and whatnot.

The reason is people receive, they distort and they generalize information according to their personality in their thinking style. That's where a lot of this gets missed because people just give out the book, say, this is how we do things here.

You're going to, you're going to conform to it. If you want to be part of the company, what you really need to do is reverse that.

And I want, if, if you're looking to come and work in my corporation, I'm an HR and I'm looking to hire you.

I'm going to ask you what your value system is, what makes you tick, and then from there I can decide, okay, she may not be the best fit in the engineering department, but she would certainly be a good fit in the marketing department. How would you like a job in marketing? I know you went to school for engineering, but you get a knack for that.

Hit their, hit their talents at their strong points. And once you can do that and you build a team, as you said, that they're compatible, I'll tell you what, that engine is going to hum like a race car.

It is just going to be the best team that you can have. You see that in professional sports teams. I grew up in Boston, okay, so sorry Yankee fans, but Red Sox fan.

nd if you go back to the year: 2004

And what the reason was teamwork. They all meshed personality wise and they had each other's backs. You can take that same structure into the corporate world.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:10:56

So true, so true. So, you know, it's interesting that we're. So Two questions.

I'm going to ask one of them first because obviously as coaches we know we're not supposed to stack them, but. And I still tend to do it anyway. But what happens? Or.

And do you think a lot of people today when you're talking about values, when you're asking what makes you tick would be like, what do you mean? Like they don't know. They, they don't know their values. They don't, they haven't pinned them down.

They don't, they don't really know what makes them Tick.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:11:42

I'll tell you what, I'm going to disagree with you respectfully on that because subconsciously they do know. The ego, as I've learned, prevents us sometimes for admitting it.

I, I had an experience about a year and a half, was a year ago January in Las Vegas on stage.

And I was with a girl, a lady named Lauren lehave, who does a lot of National Achiever Conference emceeing and whatnot, works with Tony Robbins, all that. And she had me on stage and boy, she got to admit me.

Some things that I thought I'd never say in public, but they were my true essence, my true inner feelings. And when that happens, the shift in the audience was amazing. All of a sudden they were receptive, they wanted to know me.

I had a, When I got off the stage, we were breaking for lunch.

There were a line of people waiting to hug me and thank me for being so open and honest and sharing that because they felt it or were too afraid to admit it.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:12:47

Right, right.

And I, I, I, I think people know it, but I don't always know if people were, if, if people know almost sometimes how to articulate what makes them, what makes them tick.

So in an interview situation, like, you know, you know, there's like those lists and I think it probably wasn't until I don't know how many years ago, but like I looked at a list, it's like, what are the top six characteristics that you like that really resonate you, that are, that make up you, you know, and it's like a, you know, it's whatever list it is. It could be like leadership, authenticity, honesty, whatever.

But sure, I don't necessarily, I, and I think it's true, like, you have to, you, we do inherently need to know what those values are, that we need to align that to align ourselves with the right company.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:13:41

Absolutely.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:13:41

But I sometimes do wonder, like, that's why I was I thinking, like, I don't always know if people know how. I guess the better question is, do you think people know how to articulate it, like without being, without it being pulled from them?

Joe Kavanagh: 00:13:53

Yeah, yeah, I have. And we teach a methodology and it's a personality methodology. And, and they're all, there's so many out there, but this one was reverse engineered.

So in other words, you take a disc assessment or Myers Briggs and all those, it tells you about you. But what if you wanted to meet me and sell me something? You want to know what makes me tick, don't you? So you can connect.

That's what they Do a real estate agents, they say, when you first get in the house, have them give you a tour of the home so you can look and see what pictures are on the wall, travel places they've traveled to, diplomas they have trophies they won, etc. Etc. So you get to know the people.

Well, I use a set of four cards in this methodology and each of these cards has a set of values on and there's 12 values on each card. And literally I hand them the cards and I say, do me a favor, take a look at all these four cards and all the values on them.

And once you do sort the cards in order of what sounds most like you on top, aggressively down to what's least like you on the bottoms. And it takes less than 90 seconds. 100% of the time. People do it.

There's a scientific reason behind it because the script I just used touches all types of personalities. And I always make it a fun thing and say, hey, I like to do things a little different, have a little fun at the same time. Yep. For that.

And who's going to say no? Right? So you get them to do it, they look at it.

Some people do it in 10, 15 seconds, some people take a couple of minutes, but afterwards they sort them out and they hand them back to me. And once they do, I know what their primary value system is and I know what isn't important to them by what's on the bottom.

And in between that second, the one they put in the second place that supports their primary.

So in other words, they're basically that first one, but a lot of support from the second one, the third one tells me where they go when they're in stress, which is so vital in.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:16:04

Real estate right now.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:16:06

I didn't create this methodology. A lady named Sherry Tree did. It's called bank. It's an acronym for Blueprint, Action, Nurturing and Knowledge.

We found out about this when we went to a National Achievers conference and I liked it so much that we signed up to get trained in it and then we became certified trainers. Nowadays I incorporate it in our coaching program and it's one of the primary tools we use to understand people.

What did that, how does that work in real life? Well, before I knew this, I was already a realtor distinction, which is a top 10% of all the agents.

he industry average is around: 2022

My conversion rate went from 37% to 86%. Yeah, I was shocked.

The reason being, I do that when I first sit down with somebody, you and I sit down to talk about how we're going to sell your house. I find out who you are, and I can speak to your value system.

That way I can be the best agent possible instead of just being me and expecting you to understand. For example, there are certain people that I typically give examples, like an engineer or an architect, somebody like that.

They, they wanted a knowledge, they want precision, a scientist or somebody, they've got to know everything. They want to know everything. They want all the data you can give them. And the more you give them, the happier they are. Right.

I'm the opposite of that. I'm in what we call an action personality. I like spontaneity, fun, flexibility, winning, all that stuff. Right?

So if you come to me to do a presentation and you're going to start an hour of facts, I'm out of there. I mean, after five minutes, I'm like, if the. This is going to take too long, I haven't got time for this. I just want you to cut to the chase.

And you would say, joe, here's. I've got all the data here. Basically, we're going to make get this much for your house and you're going to make this much money. Cool, Good deal. Done.

I don't read contracts, things like that. There are other people that do. So you have to go step by step with them. When you do what they want. People work with people they like.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:18:33

Right?

Joe Kavanagh: 00:18:34

The same thing applies to a corporate team when people understand each other. Like, I might know that you process things a little bit different than me.

So let's, let's just say for an example, you're one of those high intelligence people that just, you can't answer a question until you've analyzed it. So I'm not going to go up to you and say, hey, Jaclyn, this is going to be great. Let's go.

You go say, whoa, whoa, wait a minute, I got to have some information here.

But if I walk up to you and say, Jaclyn, here's some data about this program or chore that we want to do this mission, we want to accomplish whatever it is. And here's what's. Based on what has happened at other companies and how successful it's been.

Here's some charts that show the progress they made, or in my case, went from 37, 86%, et cetera. Et cetera, you're going to eat that up and you're going to look at it and analyze it. You're going to say, okay, that makes sense, yeah, I'll do it.

Or I need more information. I'll get you the information. So different ways of dealing with people, but again, once you understand them and how they think, that's when you can.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:19:41

Get along, you know, and it's so true. And you know, it's when you understand people. It's so it's so important to understand them and find.

And I think one of the biggest tools about this and I think this is a key takeaway listeners is at the crux of the whole thing is to really understand if you need to lead people or you're a leader of people or you want to become a better leader, find the best way to get to know them. And the bank system is a great way.

Find something, use some tool that you can do so that the people that are in your tribe, in your fold as I like to call it, you know that you're going to get to know them better because then you can lead them better. And the whole point of leadership is to help people, you know, as if I'm the leader. I'm here to help rise the entire, my entire tribe.

You know, if we're in that boat, we're. I'm going to try to make that tie rise.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:20:43

Absolutely. And that's the key is to ask open ended questions that gets people to open up more. Instead of saying do you prefer vanilla ice cream or chocolate?

That's a wanted open ended. Yeah.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:21:00

Right.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:21:00

Instead, are you an ice cream lover? Oh really? What kind do you like? What's your favorite? And then I, I like this kind or that kind. Next thing you know you're bonding.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:21:11

Right.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:21:11

It makes all the difference.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:21:13

And that's such a key thing too, I think.

Also, you know, I almost would say leaders if you've got people in your fold that are, that are working with you, help them become better question askers.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:21:26

Yes.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:21:27

Like that is a huge skill to have. And you know, and I was, and I, and I was, you know, asking questions and the other big skill and I think this is actually the harder one too.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:21:43

Oh, yes, yes. You know, if, if I may.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:21:49

Yeah.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:21:49

One of, one of the quotes I like to use is when you're in a conversation with somebody, the interested, not interesting, they don't want to hear about me. People love to talk about themselves though.

So when one of my things I like to say if, if you say you Know, I don't like chocolate or vanilla ice cream. I'm more of a caramel swirl type lady or some name I never heard of. This is really fascinating. Tell me more.

That one line right there is a bonding line, and it gets people to open up and share things with you that maybe they wouldn't have, and you get to know each other.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:22:31

It is. Right. It is so true. And that, you know, you know, it is so. It is so important.

And, and I was, I shared this the other day with a colleague and we were talking about this whole thing about getting to know people and opening up.

And, and I said, you know, it's amazing to me how different I think my own experience would have been in, in corporate if in fact the people that were leading got to know me.

And so that's actually, again, that's one of the biggest reasons why we are here, helping leaders be good leaders, be better leaders, be unstoppable leaders, because we want people to be wanting to be and stay at companies versus running away from them.

And most people leave companies because again, as we just shared a few minutes ago too, they don't feel heard, they don't feel valued, they don't feel appreciated. And by asking people questions about themselves so you get to know them, you're already being a better leader.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:23:40

Interested?

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:23:41

Yes, interested.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:23:43

It's telling that person, hey, I want to know you. This isn't just a job where, you know, I dictate orders to you or whatnot or deadlines. I mean, I want to understand you. Who wants to go to work?

Well, this is why I don't work for anybody else.

Because who wants to go to work and just take orders and be told what to do and when to do it and, you know, what time you got to be there, what time you go home? All that stuff doesn't work for me. But if you want to connect with me and, and say, hey, let's see if we can work together on this. What.

What would you like to see happen here? Get their input.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:24:22

And it's so true. So many companies are more rigid and they're more tellers versus being inquiry.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:24:32

Like, it's right up, down, top, down layers. Yeah. You can't jump up three layers and talk to somebody else. Actually, you can't. Just the belief is given that you can't.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:24:47

Right. Or that there might be some backlash if you do potentially.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:24:55

Yes, yes. And yeah, in many situations you're right.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:25:00

Right. Like, you know, like, you've always heard that saying. It's like, don't Go over their head, right?

Joe Kavanagh: 00:25:05

Yeah.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:25:07

Don't go over your boss's head because there's got to be like, don't go over them because that's gonna happen.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:25:15

I, I gotta admit, I'm a bit stubborn. I'm, I'm a thick headed Irishman and I can say that I was born in Ireland, so I had the legal right to make fun of me.

I don't have that accent because I was six months old and they kicked me out. They had too many hoodlums already that year. But, but that's the thing I have.

You call tech support for something or just call up someplace you need information and you need something changed. Hey, can I. Didn't you charge me something on my credit card that you really shouldn't have? Can you cancel that?

Oh, no, I don't have the authority to do that. Well, let me talk to your supervisor. Well, I can't do that. Why not? Well, they're not available, so.

Well, what kind of company you work for, if the supervisor is available and if you put up enough of a fuss, you'll get the supervisor. And I've literally done this before. I've gone through two or three layers.

But when I was younger, here's what I used to do before I got wise and it actually worked for me. When I had my own appraisal company, I would call up a bank and it's something I didn't like, some guideline they came up with or whatever.

And I said, I need to talk to the owner of the bank. Well, you can't do that. Well, why not? Well, because they're just not available. I said, of course they are. They're available. They're running a bank.

You know, they're available. Well, we don't have an actual owner. Well, who makes the decisions? You have a president and the CEO, right? I want to talk to them.

You may not get to that person, but you're certainly going to get up to somebody that's on the board. So I like, I call it the top down complaint method. We just, hey, let me talk to the owner. And you will.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:26:56

That's it. Yeah, right.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:26:57

They, they just feel, those people that answer the phone just feel, oh, he must be pretty important if he thinks he can talk to the owner. You kind of put a psychological thing in their head and they're like, well, I better move them up the ladder pretty quick here.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:27:10

So that just actually gave me an idea.

I need to make sure that we actually had a funny incident the other day with a company and A price issue with a product and just exactly what you just said, which is my husband called and asked for supervisor. Asked for supervisor, got the supervisor and guess what happened? The supervisor hung up on him.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:27:36

I have heard that a lot. They need our, they need yours in my training for sure.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:27:43

And I was like, wow, that is just unheard of.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:27:52

And today, guess this is what I do if they don't want to cooperate with me. Well, I really hate to go on social media about this, but that is my last resort. You'd be surprised how quickly you get an answer.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:28:07

Then you know it's very true. I have used social media for that same. You know, like if there's an issue, it is amazing what happens and what response you get back.

But it is, you know, and here's the key thing.

And here, if you haven't caught this as an insight, folks, as you're listening to this, your customers are really important and the insight is to help your people. Let your team have the authority to make it right for the people that are calling in and, and, and be a good company that's listening.

The last thing you want is to have somebody that's so angry that they will. Just because companies can get destroyed in just a few minutes with bad publicity.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:29:05

Absolutely, yes.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:29:07

Make it so that people want to meet people.

That your customer service and that the you, the way that you treat your customers is so extraordinarily off the charts good that people are going to share on social media about how amazing it is.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:29:27

Yes. And I want to bring up a point. You reminded me of this and this actually happened.

I had an experience with this company where they had a problem with their, their, what do you want to call it? The connections with the public. Why words are skipping me today anyway. Their marketing image, if you, if you want to say that.

And I found out what's the reason that you hang up on people. Why don't you want the supervisor to talk to them? And invariably I find out because they're just going to yell at us. So it's no point in doing it.

They're not going to listen to us.

After they go through some training and you teach them what we just talked about, basically be interested, show some compassion, show some interest in them, show some agreement with them. I understand how you feel. Yes, I, I would feel the same way. But just starting that process and listening people will calm down. Distressed.

And that's what I call it when we work with our magic here is basically talking them off the ledge. Distressed out. They're ready to Just do something drastic. It's like, okay, let's calm down.

You don't say it that way, obviously, but it's your, your process. Get them to calm down.

Get them back to their natural relaxed personality and make that connection and say, okay, let's see if we can work together to work this out. Now you're saying this, you know, we can't do this. It's just impossible.

But what we could do is, and you negotiate an agreement till everybody's happy. But you can't negotiate an agreement when somebody is so wound up they can't see straight. They see red.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:31:13

Right. It's, it's, it's being a solution finder and a problem solver and making people feel good about it.

But yes, you cannot have a, have a discussion or a conference or a dialogue or anything when one person is just deeming because they're not going to hear properly. And it's so true that you said that. Yeah.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:31:34

And for the people that like to hear, okay, that all sounds good, but what kind of results does that get? One company we worked with, their conversion rate jumped from 30, 32% to 62%. And year over year, their revenue increased by $50 million.

There's a company with 42 people.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:31:53

Wow, that's awesome.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:31:55

Yeah. All by listening instead of talking.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:32:01

That's amazing. So, Joe, I could talk to you for hours. I love the program that you're offering.

How can people get in touch with you, learn more about you, learn more about the programs that you offer.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:32:12

Yep.

I'm not a techie guy, so I don't have all these websites and everything, but I am on LinkedIn as Joe Kavanaugh because I'm on Facebook, I have an Instagram account and I don't do tick tock. Just don't have time for that. Anyway, that's probably the easiest ways to get me. And I don't mind sharing my phone number, if that's okay.

-: 8506

You're going to get me to talk to and we can jump on a call, have a 15 to 30 minute discovery call, get to know each other a little bit, see if we can help each other. And if we can't, hey, at least now we know each other.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:33:01

That's great. I absolutely love it. So listeners, please do me a favor, make sure that you connect with Joe, get that free 20 minute call and connect with him.

You know, connect with them on all the social socials. And please do me a favor. I know I'm sure you've gotten value out of this, because I know I have.

Click, subscribe and share this episode with your friends and colleagues. Because if we can impact and make one leader a little bit better, we are doing something good.

So this is the Unstoppable Successpodcast. I'm your host, Jaclyn Schuminger. Thank you for listening and thank you, Joe, for being an amazing guest.

Joe Kavanagh: 00:33:40

Well, thank you again. It's been an honor. And I will say this. Yes, do click and like.

Because after we met at that networking event, I clicked and liked you and I started looking at your podcast and I have learned quite a bit. So. And if I may leave with one tagline, I'd say listen to relate, not respond.

Jaclyn Strominger: 00:34:00

That's great. I love that. So thank you so much for that, Joe, and thank you again, listeners. And again, keep on listening again.

And hit subscribe and share, please. Thanks.